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Category >> bad player

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NAMECALLERS - THINK ABOUT IT....

 

Last evening yet another loser started calling the guy who busted him (not me this time) a "donkey". His statement "how could you call me with Railbirds card: 5hRailbirds card: 5c" was a statement that frequently betrays the utter stupidy, the opressive need to sound "expert" to hide your loss and utter lack of knowledge of the game most namecallers have. (The whiner put in a minimum raise UTG, the 55 guy called - the flop Railbirds card: 5dRailbirds card: 2cRailbirds card: Qs JJ guy goes all in 55 guy calls - the turn Railbirds card: 2h river Railbirds card: Ks note the JJ guy could have easliy gotten busted with a Q)

I must say first I AM NO EXPERT but I am a student of the game and have come to know a few simple, obvious things :

    1. Don't slowplay jacks, particularly online, particularly early
    2. Your table can't see your Jacks and Jacks are not a "lock hand"
    3. There are MANY opportunities to get your jacks busted from a variety of ways and its not just from others holding AA, KK,QQ either
    4. Only rookies play only the strength of their hand and expect everyone else to fold and LET them win a pot
    5. Whatever you do, whatever your skill level "putting someone on a hand" is a guess (decision based on incomplete information) sometimes you're wrong sometimes you're right. The higher your skill level and familiairity with your competition the more often you are right - making a wrong decision does not make you a donkey. It happens to every poker player every day regardless of skill level.

Now I am one to not believe that the printed words of a writer of poker books should be slavishly followed. I also think it's childish to ape the words you hear pro's say on TV (TVpokerese). I swear people seem to think it's cool to say something is "sick" and I've hear it used in so many situations I'm confused by what it is supposed to mean - but thats just me. I am one to test what I read and find out for myself the value or lack of value in what I read. I find it suspicious that a current winning, poker pro would write EVERYTHING HE KNOWS FOR GENERAL CONSUMPTION - I wouldn't. PLUS even if they did, your proper application of those writings is what matters. For example: Every artist is familiar with the same brush, paint and easel as Rembrandt, every basketball player is familiar with the same, court, ball, dribble and shot of Michael Jordan BUT almost no one else can use the same tools as they could no matter how much you read their "how I do it books". But having said that, this is one of the writing's most poker books agree on, I have found accurate so I'll relate them here. In "Super System 2" Doyle Brunson, in defense of being criticized for losing 580,000 with Railbirds card: QdRailbirds card: 8c in the final event at Bellagio in 2003 and winning the championship with "trash pocket hands" in 1976 with Railbirds card: TsRailbirds card: 2s: and 1977 with Railbirds card: TdRailbirds card: 2h said this:

"Today's tournaments are structured to be a lot faster.... You've got to play almost every hand when you're anteing high" At the very least you 've got to see the flop. It's not at all suprising I won the 1976 and the 1977 World Championship with trash hands"

"...... I'd rarely play those hands. There's little reason when the ante doesn't force you to play. A major exception is when I play a pot for the sole reason of trying to steal it Then it doesn't matter what I have. I mean I could be playing the hand without even looking at my holecards. At such time, I'd be playing my money, my position and a particular player. My hand wouldn't matter. If I was forced to look at it because I got played with, I might find two Aces, A-K or trash.... I hadn't made a pair all day, and I'd had to stay alive by stealing some pots, but on this particular play (referring to 2003), my read was wrong.

This is a capacity good pros have most amateurs don't - TO PLAY WITH NOTHING FOR REASONS OTHER THAN YOUR HAND. In non-professional games, you are also more likely to find players in a pot who chase and hit where a pro would have folded streets earlier.

One key indicator whining players of this particular low level betray is that most times their "whining about getting caught" mentions only his hand versus the busting hand. There is often little mention about preceding play and players tendicies, how many are seated at the the table, level in the tournament, stack & table position, ante/blinds or any of those "unimportant, inconvenient contributing facts/factors" that contributed to the demise.

So the next time you call someone a "donkey" think first - are you showing how little YOU really know about the game? At least consider that if you find yourself in this position a LOT (whining in the losers lounge) maybe you need to learn something...

OK I gotta admit I get more than a little perturbed by people copying "TV Code words" - it's weak make up your own stuff or at least use the words per their definition - so sue me... LOL

JonHolt(Merlin333) :cool:

p.s. If I had a nickel for everytime Jacks busted me, I'd have more money than Bill Gates -

p.s. I know I didn't bleep the word d**key this time..... what can I say

check this article out:

http://www.railbirds.com/protip.php?articleID=68


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Websters Donkey Definition........

"Websters"Definition:Donkey

Donkey:[donk]: noun, to donk v. slang. poor poker player, a player who thinks they are good but no evidence of this assertion can be found. 2. Often found shortstacked, whining or whining in the losers lounge while good players are still in the game - usually blurting unprompted questions or statements like: "play me for cash","play me for real", "freerolls suck/ are waste of time" ,"play me hu" , "I won this or that tournament last week","my bankroll is bigger than yours!" , etc., etc. etc.3. Usually in this situation being unable to beat players deemed, by player most often using this term, of lower skill. 4. Not to be confused with making a wrong read, bluffing, late positioned / big/short stack, big blinds, calling a 7 2 bluff or any other read that may give basis to call with something other than AA - they never like all other human poker players make mistakes. B. Frequently heard to exclaim "you called me with that"! note: this can usually be rebuffed with the reply "You went all in with that!" (see below: the video where Patrik Antonius' Railbirds card: AhRailbirds card: 2c all in is called by Doyle Brunson's Railbirds card: 3dRailbirds card: 3c) note: having just made the same play they earlier called out as a "donk play" when made by someone else - they never return the announcement. note: watch their hands carefully as they deftly,skillfully demonstrate how to win playing only 4 pocket pairs AA, KK, AK,QQ on the button!

5. Sometimes a mindless warning to someone who may be playing badly to stop and play better so they can win - instead of the person who cannot restrain themselves exploiting these weaknesses to win - this person would much rather play at a table with Stu Ungar, Alan Cunningham, Phil Ivey, Chip Jett, Barry Greenstein and Johnny Chan or where all players play perfectly and are therefore better than they, thereby insuring they lose (can't beat bad players / can't beat good players). (note: they frequently are "better" than these people too - no really just ask then check their ranking scores - zero does not mean they are bad)

6. Often issued as an alert to the other players of "Hey a player with "lesser skills" is taking all my chips" and a reminder of "I can beat Raymer on any given day and I am making "expert" commentary on how others should play, ignore the fact I am not winning here and now because I am unable to take advantage of my own excellent advice".

Appendix inspired by jsc88310 : Frequently the player who "checks you" to the nuts (e.g doesn't know the correct bet to give you incorrect odds to call and/or doesn't have the guts to make the bet and/or thinks it's a limit game), goes all in on the river (with 2nd or 3rd best hand) then screams "donk" ,"chaser" ,"riverrat" on the way to or from the losers lounge for twenty minutes!

7. trite,overused, "TVPokerese" for someone who is "English challenged" trying very hard to sound like they "know poker" having not mastered the actual game. Verbal device used to distract from the fact their own play is poor.

(did Webster play a lot of online poker or what!)

(c)2007 JonHolt / Merlin333 :cool:

Noah

Emmanuel

Click to see Antonius v Bruson Video  if you join use Merlin333 as reference